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Latest post Thu, Oct 10 2013 9:30 AM by stressedoutb. 14 replies.
  • Fri, Oct 4 2013 4:18 AM


    I live in an apartment complex that is owned by a Property Management Company in Arkansas... (Income Based) But as a rule tenants are discouraged calling the PMC office if we disagree with the landlord on premises actions or what have you.. When I was accused of things that were untrue and so happends on the same day I was told if the police come to the apartments one more time I will be asked to leave.. I couldnt believe what I was hearing because I was the one who called the police in the first place...


    (quick backstory) 

     another tenant here I had befriended I quickly came to realize its not in my best interest to continue any kind of friendship) i had enough n called her told her not to bother me anymore dont call come over text me and I was polite about it as well but firm) next thing i know her drunk mom comes to my door and threatens me n my young child and ranted and yelled and threatened us.. Mind you my youngest child has a mental disability so it really bothered my well if not more myself) well i called the police and the police told all of us to stay away from one another to have no contact and I obeyed that..


    The next day i got called to the office and the landlord told me if the police came here one more time i would be evicted i told her I CALLED and what the situation was..then she went to say that my daughter cant go over to these peoples apartments n continue to harass them for one my eldest child at the time had never been to my place so these people live on lies (the neighbors.. thus causing me to end contact).. anyway the drunk mom n her other daughter live next door to me now and i thought we turned out to b the best of friends but again I learned the hard way thought there is good in everyone but after a few months true colors started to show..  


    So even before I knew this lady "AKA "the apartment drunk" who came and threatened myself and my son  i had found out the landlord asked them if they would be ok since the apt they were moving into was right next to mine WOW!!


    Police are constantly called over there being arrested breaking laws and other things.. Meanwhile I have obeyed all laws rules and regulations dont have any police record not even a moving violation in my entire life... I have been a good tenant but I do speak up if I know something is wrong and can prove it on top of that..


    I may add that an incident at the complex caused injury to my child last summer and its in the final stages of negotiations and the complex is admitting to all fault) but ever since the accident happened I havnt been very liked by management here on site..


    I go about things the legal and by the word type of sense I am not a person to do things to escalate problems Ive been like a puppy that puts my tail between my legs and moves on I dont like confrontation Ill sit there and take it but not fight back with others..


    So the past few weeks these neighbors have been makng my life ***heck.. Bullying me getting in my face the list goes on and I did what is told to do in the "Rules and Regulations" I wrote a written complaint about the situation.. I thought then the trouble wold stop but instead it got worse and the next day the crap got worse and I called the landlord (Not the Property Management Office) it was after hours and next thing I know the landlord is knocking on my door at 8:30 at night and was grilling me asking me over n over if I have ever been arrested or had then police called on me.. I told her No way check my record check everything.. That I was trying to tell her ITS THE NEIGHBORS THAT HAVE THE POLICE THERE ALL THE TIME AND WHAT NOT) at the end of the conversation she told me to keep myself and my child indoors inside my place and to only come outside when I absolutely had to.. So thats what I have been doing.. I couldnt believe my eyes the nest day when there was a note on my door It was a "Written Warning that goes into my permanent file accusing me of "Unlawful Activity that caused police actions" "That I was harassing and Threatening towards other residents" "Being loud and excessively noisy causing other residents harm" I COULDNT BELIEVE MY EYES AND WHAT I WAS READING!! These are all the things I had wrote about my neighbors in my complaint... Then I was asked by the landlord if I would be willing to move like to another part of the complex (its not very big about 30  units) why would I go thru all that hassle when I havnt done a darn thing and could prove it.. So I have appealed their "warning"to me in writing.. 


    To top everything off I had to call her again at home due to physical violence to my and my child by the neighbors freind) well when I called the LL at home her husband answered I told him who I was next thing I hear is him yelling for her to come to the phone and said "Its your favorite tenant on the phone" she gets on the phone I explained to her the incident and she told me she was told not to intervene anymore that if i have future problems to handle it myself with the neighbors.. then hung up on me..


    Tenants here are expected to go by certain rules and regulations here otherwise face consequences.. So whats the point of having those if they are not goin to be enforced? or certain people can skate and some cant... 


    So now its ok for these neighbors to violate me in anyway they wish and the last incident involved my young child.. I thought thats pretty low class to involve a child who has nothing to do with this.. 


    I am soo stressed I can barely function and if i had the funds to move right this minuet I would but unable to.. 


    I have filed a discrimination complaint with HUD and I was told the process takes several weeks and I may also contact other sources at the same time that it wouldnt interfere with the HUD investigation...


    What do I do now?? I am out of energy and any responses would be greatly appreciated.

  • Fri, Oct 4 2013 7:07 AM In reply to


    What do I do now?

    I would start looking for a new place to live.  Regardless of how innocent you believe your actions are the management company CLEARLY believes you are the cause of the problems and my best guess is that when your lease expires they are not going to renew it.  Worst case is that if the cops do come again because of the warnings you have already been given they will try to evict you based on the repeated violations of the lease.

    I have filed a discrimination complaint with HUD

    I did not read your entire post as it is WAY too long but based on what I did read I do not see a basis for any illegal discrimination going on.  I see two neighbors who cannot get along and a management company who is tired of dealing with both of you.

    (quick backstory) 

    No, not a quick story that was the great American novel.  Though you get points for at least using paragraphs.  In the future BASIC facts are all that is needed not minutia.  The volunteers here tend to skip large posts of irrelevant information as it is too difficult to spend all that time to get to one question at the bottom.

    "That's just my opinion, then again I might be wrong."  Dennis Miller


  • Fri, Oct 4 2013 7:47 AM In reply to

    • Drew
    • Top 10 Contributor
    • Joined on Thu, Mar 30 2000
    • PA
    • Posts 51,431


    Suggestions from an old LL:

    If you mean Section 8 you may have broder protections under the lease forms they commonly require.

    In general a LL can elect not to renew a lease at the appropriate time for literally no reason at all...local law may vary .

    For the LL to seek to evict the victim of the troublemaker rather than the trouble maker may seem most uunfair but its very likely not illegal.

    To seek to evict you for having exercised your rights to call police to protect you against a person threatening harm obviously is a form of retialitory eviction....but whether that's an illegal step is quite unclear.

    If the LL seeks to evict then whatever reason he cites in the action he bears the burden to prove if it goes to court.  And you get to present your side of the case..and focus on the specific point LL raised ...the rest of your social problems with bad or drunk neighbors probably have no legal weight


    Some LLs write language to try to say if police come to your place XX times you are a problem careful to read your lease...that language may not hold up in court but you'd be smart to know what's in your lease or included rules.

    Its a big  stretch.and may depend on state law..but in general a LL is required to provide you safe habitable place...most often that means inside your 4 walls ..but it has been stretched to include hallways and parking lots in various jurisdictions?.and if some drunk is pounding on your hallway door you might be able to visit the problem upon management.

    There are some attorneys with almost a missionary approach to helping low income people deal with things like bad LLs might be smart to find any such person in your area before this reaches the crisis stage. LL may be a pro at bully games.

    But it NOT up to LL to solve any bad social drama created by your poor choices of earlier friend or continuing bad social drama be it with a tenant next door or somebody 3 blocks or 3 cities away

  • Fri, Oct 4 2013 11:53 AM In reply to


    First read the AR landlord tenant statute and see if there is any help in there:

    If that doesn't help, you'll have to consult an attorney.

    • The right of the people 
    • to keep and bear arms,
    • shall not be infringed.
  • Fri, Oct 4 2013 2:37 PM In reply to


    then she went to say that my daughter cant go over to these peoples apartments n continue to harass them

    Are you SURE your daughter never went there?  Make sure she knows that while you love her for trying to help, her contacting these neighbors in any way won't help you, and could even cause you to get evicted.

    there was a note on my door It was a "Written Warning that goes into my permanent file accusing me of "Unlawful Activity that caused police actions" "That I was harassing and Threatening towards other residents" "Being loud and excessively noisy causing other residents harm"

    Did the note have your name in it?  Are you sure your problem neighbors didn't move it to your door after discovering it on their door?

    Then I was asked by the landlord if I would be willing to move like to another part of the complex (its not very big about 30  units) why would I go thru all that hassle when I havnt done a darn thing and could prove it.

    The reason to go through all that hassle is obvious to me:  to get some distance between your poor son and these problem neighbors, in the hope that they will eventually forget about you and start bothering someone else.  At a minimum, if they do go to your new place to bother you, it will be more obvious who is the problem.

    In your shoes, I would at least ask to see the place they were offering.  Then if it was an OK place, I'd think about how I could get a move done.  Who knows, maybe to get a little more peace in her life the landlord would be willing to get the staff to help out a bit.  Could your eldest daughter help?  If your lease will expire in just a couple of months, and you'd like to stay in the complex longer than that, one idea would be to ask if they'd be willing to sign a new one-year lease on the new place, and terminate your old lease as soon as you move, so the effort of moving will be worth it.

    Anyway, as far as eviction goes, you should know:

    Under AR landlord-tenant law, a tenant can be evicted for being 5 or more days late with the rent, for violating the lease (and not remedying the violation within 14 days of the eviction notice), or for creating a "common nuisance" (drug dealing, prostitution, stuff like that).  At the end of a lease that's for a specific period of time, the landlord has no obligation to continue or extend the tenancy even if the tenant has been an absolute angel.

    Here's a link to the AR laws.  Landlord-tenant law is in Title 18 (Property), Subtitle 2 (Real Property), Chapters 16 and 17.

  • Sun, Oct 6 2013 12:55 AM In reply to


    yes im sure my daughter had not and still hasnt been there she doesnt even know these people and at the time this supposedly happened my daughter wasnt even in the state... sooo go figure... This is just one small example of how these people lie and do it well and put the focus on everyone else and not them.. 

    But the thing is I CAN prove my foot steps... But they cant so words and stories are all they have..

    As far as the note.. I thought the same thing they musta put the names on the wrong paper.. but NOPE its not the case..

    Funny thing is the next day after I wrote this seeking advice (I know my internet postings had nothing to do with this) but anyway I just got out of the shower getting ready to take my son to a dr appt and we were running behind and i had several loud knocks on my door along with doorbell ringing I didnt answer my childs appt came first.. They eventually went away but it was my LL and the Property Mngr I have no idea why they thought they could just show up and I would gladly allow them in.. Because by law they need to give me a 24hr notice.. So I come back a cpl of hours later and yet again another note on my door.. telling me I need to wash down the oil spot in my drive... For one its only visible if im not home and also on the note said they would be checking my stove top.. last inspection they said it needed to be wiped down and was supposed to come back but never did and top of that the original paper was dated March of last year.. I asked her what is this and she told me and then whited out her mistakes..

    So this is pure harassment and discrimination... 100 times outa 100 al inspections are done on the same day for every person...

    The ONLY time the police have had contact with me was like I said before they even moved in next to me there was trouble and came to my door drunk and yelling at me and my son and I had no idea who this lady was.. It scared us both.. The second and last tie was when the neighbor asked me to call because there was a large snake on her porch.. 

    What am I supposed to do.. Stand and take the abuse and do nothing about it?? and the other night when I had my child with me and they got in his face to get in mine for no reason at all well thats too far!! I mean when u start involving the kids in what ever.. Thats gone too far... 

    From what I have heard is they want to squeeze me out so then the neighbors daughter can move into my place so they can be side by side...

    i just dont understand that others can break every rule they expect us to go by but its a pic n choose who has to abide and who doesnt.....

    sooo been busy making sure nothings out of place in or out of my apartment it will drive them nuts lol trying to find sumthin wrong.. (I hope)  but also at the same time its been stressful on myself n my child it has affected my mental and physical health ( I deal with lupus and anxiety) and has only enhanced my symptoms and def my appearance.. Im sure it would anyone when you're terrified to even open your door..

    As far as moving to another apartment like they offered.. not worth my time because they want me to pack my stuff up only to move within yards of where im at now.. if im going to pack up I will def find another place and far away from this one..

    But the thing is all this goes into my HUD file.. And the last thing I want is false allegations on my record

  • Sun, Oct 6 2013 4:14 PM In reply to


    As far as the note.. I thought the same thing they musta put the names on the wrong paper.. but NOPE its not the case..

    According to your reading of your lease, are the things you are accused of in this note lease violations?

    If so, I think you are in trouble here.  Let's say all your nearby neighbors are willing to sign statements (and testify in court) that you have never been noisy or disruptive etc.  If they are afraid of the problem neighbors, they probably won't be willing to get involved, but if they did sign statements then you could get those statements and send copies to the landlord, and at least she would be unlikely to start an eviction on that basis.

    But if she really wants to see the last of you, she would just look for a different pretext to remove you.  Depending on what kind of person she is and how badly she wants you gone, she might even stoop to manufacturing a pretext (such as planting illegal drugs in your apartment and calling the police).

    if im going to pack up I will def find another place and far away from this one..

    My personal opinion is that this is what you need to do, and quickly.  If you go this route, don't sign any new leases without first getting your current landlord to sign a release, saying they won't hold you to the rest of your lease if you find a new place and move out.  And ask her to refrain from putting anything negative in your HUD file while you look for a new place.  You can't force her, but if she wants you gone she won't want to hurt your chances of finding a new place.  I don't recommend you take too long about finding a new place, since if she starts getting the idea that it would be faster to evict you, she might go back to that plan (probably without telling you).

    But before you do anything, have you tried contacting a local legal aid organization?  If you live in low-income housing, you might qualify for free legal advice, which will probably be a whole lot better-informed than my views are!

  • Sun, Oct 6 2013 5:46 PM In reply to


    So this is pure harassment and discrimination...

    Most "harassment" and discrimination is legal. Under federal laws relating to housing, it is only illegal if the discrimination is because of race, color, national origin, religion, sex, familial status (including children under the age of 18 living with parents or legal custodians, pregnant women, and people securing custody of children under the age of 18), and disability. For more information, see the HUD page on federal fair housing laws. Arkansas doesn't add any more protection than federal law does, as I recall.

    I don't see anything in your posts that clearly suggests that any of the prohibited reasons under federal law are the basis for the management company's actions (or inactions) towards you. Unless HUD can see enough here to prove that illegal discrimination is taking place, it's not likely to act on the complaint.

    The sense I get is that the management company is unhappy at dealing with the conflicts between you and your neighbor and would probably like to simply get rid of both of you if it could to make the problems go away. As a result, I don't see any quick resolution to this other than for you to simply move out of the complex entirely. In my view, that's probably the best way to get relief from what's happening here. That's not any legal observation, but a practical one.

  • Sun, Oct 6 2013 6:46 PM In reply to


    I have lived here longer than the others... After the first false accusations well over a year ago btw that I was able to prove I WASNT at fault.. I was left alone from then until now.. So for the past 14 months I havnt had any problems with anyone.. No citations, complaints or anything else it was like I was invisible here.... 

    As far as the other neighbors go... They are not happy with these people either....

    I called HUD and explained the situation in full detail... I have a case number and was informed I do have basis for a legitimate complaint... First being discriminated against us both (My son & I) we both have documented mental conditions.. So taking advantage of the fact that they can get away with things with me and thinking im not mentally capacitated enough to understand and just do as they as they say... I am a very nervous person.. Im also very emotional and fall to pieces in the slightest of stressful situations... I may not think clearly at that exact moment when things are going on because confrontation is not my thing.. But once I have the time to sit and think without no one around I can get a better grasp on things and think a lil clearer... This is the reason why I havnt verbally or physically fought back and went about things the right way by filling the complaint the way its explained to do in the lease and by HUDS process...

    The complaint with HUD also states there could be possible "Retaliation" due to the lawsuit that is ongoing with the complex...

    The way I see things is when I have had a concern about certain things because sumthin didnt feel right and the LL thought I was stupid enough to accept stuff and not realize that yes there is sumthing wrong here.. So when the LL bosses and their bosses get involved and the LL has to fix them "otherwise gets in trouble by not doing what they are supposed to be doing" This crap happens... So I can see where it would make the LL not happy with me but if the LL went by the rules in the first place all would be dandy...

    I have not just raised my voice everytime I felt like it... There was a reason because I would much rather put my time to better use.. But when it concerns my and my child's safety and well being thats another story...

    So the past 14 months have been great and pleasant and even the vibe between myself and the LL have been friendly...

    and to be honest before this incident I was well aware the LL wasnt these peoples best friend either...

    The police have been here but not at my door but next to me.... i.e. physical fights between them and other residents and between each other in the family.. Drunk and disorderly.. Warrant arrests because when the police were called and asking their names and well wudda know outstanding warrants and going straight to jail.. My neighbors other daughter who lives behind us is has already been accused of fraud and currently has to pay back housing mucho money....

    I would have thought the LL would be always aware of all this stuff even if they were not on property...

    @  karen2222 according to the rules and regs and what im being accused of is yes against the rules.. But like I have said I am innocent of these accusations this is why I am appealing this...

    I highly doubt the police have anything to gain by lying to the LL and falsifying documents that yes indeed I have been unlawful and repeatedly in trouble with law enforcement... If the LL wants to believe these neighbors lies over the Police dept.. Then sumthings really wrong....

    As far as being threatening and harassing to others and prior complaints against me is sumthing new to me.. As far as I know this is a first.. and I still havnt been told directly that there is indeed a written complaint against me just accusations in words....

    HUD also directed me to other legal resources in edition to the one I have with them... 

    I have been reading every single word in the lease and other papers regarding the rules n stuff and I have came across many discrepancies between what HUD expects from all parties and what the LL expects...

    I know this all lengthy but I am trying to give the best detail as possible....

    • I do have one last question that needs answered immediately because im really stressing..
    Since I did get wrote up for my stove not being wiped down... I have a follow up inspection in the morning and on the follow up inspection notice it states they will be here to reinspect my stove... Since its just for that (and my driveway as well) can they also do a FULL inspection of my apartment.. Looking in every nook and cranny other than the stove and the drive???

  • Mon, Oct 7 2013 2:18 PM In reply to

    • Drew
    • Top 10 Contributor
    • Joined on Thu, Mar 30 2000
    • PA
    • Posts 51,431


    Section 8?

    I was a LL for a few decades but never would checking a driveway spot or stove top cleanliness be on my list UNLESS I was looking for excuses to do something---and quite frankly the local judge around me would have tossed me out of her courtroom to do such things.

    That said, if there are problems, I dont necessarily blame a LL to seek to evict both sides of a trouble equation and see which one happens first.

    It is likley that you cannot be held to a standard higher than allowed by HUDin its leases which form part of the deal with LL.

    In some sense LL may not care--odds are local HUD will send him a replacement tenant 

    Some of the pro bono / low cost attorneys that defend low income tenants can be super good at that role--try to find one of these saints in your area



  • Mon, Oct 7 2013 11:06 PM In reply to


    and I still havnt been told directly that there is indeed a written complaint against me just accusations in words....

    What do you mean by "a written complaint"?  A complaint filed at HUD?

    If the notice that was on your door was addressed to you by name, then that's a written notice that the management is claiming you did those things.  I am not familiar with the rules on housing subsidies, but if the things they accused you of in that notice are lease violations, then the management may be getting ready to evict you (in accordance with general landlord-tenant law).

    You say you are innocent, but if management is accusing you, I hope you have more evidence of your innocence than just your say-so.  If it's your word against the landlord's, you are likely to lose, because you have an obvious reason to say you are innocent even if you're not, but the landlord does not have such an obvious reason to lie.  And the police aren't there all the time, so their saying they've never been called because of your noise or disruptive behavior helps your case but doesn't prove it (it only proves nobody called the police on you).

    Since I did get wrote up for my stove not being wiped down... I have a follow up inspection in the morning and on the follow up inspection notice it states they will be here to reinspect my stove... Since its just for that (and my driveway as well) can they also do a FULL inspection of my apartment.. Looking in every nook and cranny other than the stove and the drive???

    If they decide to do that, I'm not sure how you'd stop them.  But I don't think they have a right to do things like open drawers.  Their right is to check that you are taking decent care of THEIR property, not to snoop into your stuff.

    I think it's very unlikely that they will do more than reinspect the stove, unless there are problems out in plain sight, that they can't avoid seeing once they are in your apartment.


  • Wed, Oct 9 2013 10:43 PM In reply to


    its urban housing....

    Im really upset!! This is the second time to where they set up a date to come and inspect my stove n driveway and didn't show up! Thats pure harassment as far as im concerned and the driveway thingy the neighbors car leaks as well and not sure what it leaks but its also eating up the asphalt I know this cuz before all this drama took place they told me about it and had me look to see if I could figure it out...

    I also called again to the PPM today n left a msg asking wut they decided with my warning I appealed because th4e charges I know r not true I also told them why have rules n regs if they dont enforce them and also telling them my neighbors r parking in both of my spaces Ive had to sit there n wait for them move.. Also told them I wanted to be called back and not ignore me because upon moving in I was assured a safe peaceful environment living here in writing... Im stressed out physically and mentally


  • Wed, Oct 9 2013 10:52 PM In reply to


    @karen2222 YES I HAVE EVIDENCE I AM INNOCENT!! ive stated many times here I HAVE NO POLICE RECORD WHAT SO EVER (i.e. warning tickets arrests) NONE!!!!! That right there is proff enough enough!!

    The neighbors r the ones who are having to pay back food stamps and housing for proven fraud and also have arrests records and calls since moving in.... Police records dont lie!!

    As far as the complaint goes it wasnt from HUD it was from management sad to think the LL would take these peoples word alone without investigating further...

  • Wed, Oct 9 2013 10:56 PM In reply to


    Besides all that if all these things were true  why did they wait till I turned in my complaint to comap[lin themselves? so all the sudden in the matter of a day I was arrested and threatened other residents...

    If this was true they should have files their complaint when or right after all this supposidly took place... BRECAUSE IT NEVER DID!!

  • Thu, Oct 10 2013 9:30 AM In reply to


    What frustrates me the most is I am doing what I was asked to do.. Staying in my apartment and when going outside I dont even look that way I go the long way around to throw my trash out and get my mail so I dont even have to walk past their apartment.... But the neighbors are continuing to do as they please... Kinda hard to live in peace when the others are not... Still to this day I have not confronted or taked to the neighbors.

    These written complaints and the violation letter goes into my HUD file... The last thing I want is untrue statements in my file preventing future moves...

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